September 27, 2005

Yes they will.

Oooohhh, I can't wait to read this in The Atlantic for November.

Posted by Rae at September 27, 2005 04:49 PM
Comments

I'll be damned; I admit to being surprised but interested.

Posted by: Altar Girl at September 27, 2005 05:20 PM

Rae--

You might find this review interesting.

I've been meaning to post on it, but it's sitting in my draft folder.

Posted by: Craig at September 28, 2005 05:11 AM

I don't know. I thought I'd read that most criminals in prison are from father-less environments. 'Course that could be more related to economic issues. It certainly couldn't be a race-issue, like Katrina.

Posted by: GrumpyBunny at September 28, 2005 04:49 PM

Knowing Caitlin Flanagan, she'll destroy the assertation, oops, I mean research.

Thanks for the link, Craig.

GB-certainly not. ;)

Posted by: Rae at September 28, 2005 11:36 PM

Simply put, this article praises the idea of raising to believe he will be useless/unnecessary for the raising of his children.

Doesn't that smack of cognitive dissonance?

My experience is much more in line with the Glenn Sacks article Craig links.
I once read a book called "The Measure of a Man" by someone named Shapiro, I think. It said that the mother is very important for helping a child understand their role in the family, the importance, their self-love. The father is important for helping a child understand their role in society, that every person is equally important in life, their respect for others.
Makes sense to me.

Posted by: Nathan at October 5, 2005 11:48 AM

Oops.
I read too quickly. I should have said, "It seems clear this book is..." rather than "...this article is..." I haven't read the article.
I also haven't read the book, but the Glenn Sacks review gives enough specifics, and fits with my own readings of similar subjects enough that I accept the review as accurate.

But I could be way wrong. [shrug]
All I know is that Mr. Sacks describes my experience and understanding almost perfectly.

I still maintain the cognitive dissonance point: if one insists a son grows up better without a father, one is also raising the son to become a man that has no relevance in the family. That just doesn't make sense, and cannot be good for the male child. It reduces men's only function to be sperm donor and financial supporter.

Make the best of a bad situation? Certainly. You do what you have to do, and try to minimize problems.
Celebrate it? Encourage it? Promote it as better based only on conviction rates? Absurd.
I will not judge my success as a parent based on whether my children get arrested or have discipline problems in school (well-disciplined children should be a given), but on whether they are able to form and maintain good, strong, healthy relationships with the people important to them, and whether they are able to have a stable life that allows them to meet most of their goals and dreams.

I'll check back after you've read the article to see how they handle those aspects.

Posted by: Nathan at October 5, 2005 01:03 PM

I would never support the position that a father is unnecessary in a child's life just as Caitlin Flanagan doesn't support the wild assertations of Dr. Drexler's limited study.

Would you think me so far off the deep end, Nathan, as to say Dr. Drexler's study is accurate in any way?

Although I read the article through bleary eyes Monday night, I won't have time this week to write a post concerning the article as I have 4-6 page essay due on Monday and have to decide a platform for a faux run for a school board position for another class. It will have to wait, but I can cut and paste and send the article to you, so maybe you could post your thoughts ;)

Posted by: Rae at October 5, 2005 03:17 PM

Sure, send the article to me, and I'll leave my comments.
And I didn't think you'd link an article that said "Men bad" approvingly. I just didn't understand at all.
Here's the Timeline in My Mind:
Rae: Here's this article. I can't wait to read it...it sounds interesting.
Craig: Here's a review written by Glenn Sacks.
Me (after reading review): Yep, Mr. Sacks is right. I must share my $.02.

That was the point I made a fool of myself, not keeping the elements straight. I can live with looking stupid.

Posted by: Nathan at October 6, 2005 03:04 AM
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